Snood 4 Mac Version to Try Out

[Administrator]

Here you go - let me know what you think.

http://www.womgames.com/games/index.php?game=mac-4

There can be a little strangeness with the fonts the first time you run it, but if you quit and restart, it should be OK.

Stuff that doesn’t work that will later:

Alternate puzzle levels (default levels should be fine)
Alternate graphics sets
Snood Network stuff
Resizing the window, other than by the maximize (+) button
Setting the preference paths and other detailed preference stuff

Disclaimer: I haven’t tested it too thoroughly yet, so there may be some issues I’m not aware of yet. It may crash frequently and hard. Use at your own risk.

-Dave

[ephraimephraim]

In the Mac beta, trying to load a saved game doesn't let me continue the game, it seems to think the saved game has ended. iBook G4, Mac OS X 10.4.9 (I think).

[ephraimephraim]

iBook G4, Mac OS X 10.4.9 (I think).
It's actually 10.4.10.

[ragamuffin]

I also had a problem re-loading saved games. I could only do it after starting a new game and then aborting that.

To me, the beta feels awkward. IMHO, each new version has gotten more awkward. The OS X version has never felt as smooth as the Classic, but I've gotten used to it. I've never liked the Windows version. In this one, it's very hard to sneak snoods into gaps. Maybe that's your goal?

K

[Trogdor]

Feels a bit awkward to me, as well, but I'll keep testing.

Glad to see an update, though. We waited a long time for it. :)

[ephraimephraim]

1. Wherever you need to hit return to acknowledge something, you should allow enter, too. It's closer to the mouse (if you're right-handed) on full-size keyboards.

2. Even brief responses on this beta testing thread would assure folks that you're listening and motivate us to help you out more.

[Trogdor]

The game is starting to feel a bit more comfortable as I play it more, but I agree with ragamuffin that it's harder to sneak snoods into gaps then before. The angles also seem tighter when trying to shoot snoods around other snoods and skulls.

The game doesn't seem to make the fans of my iMacG5 run as hard as the previous version I have (version 3.01M). I am running OS 10.4.10, btw.

Other comments:

I would love it more if there wasn't such a long wait between levels, while waiting for the scores to post and all. I have the same complaint with Snoodoku, actually, which I downloaded and bought shortly after I heard about it. I don't need to see all my stats between each level. I just want to dismiss them and move on.

I would also prefer a "Pause" mode with no moving images, as was the case in 3.01. Moving images make my fans run while I am taking care of other tasks, and it's kind of annoying.

Thanks for all your work on the newest version of Snood for Macs. :)

[ephraimephraim]

When entering my name for the high scores list, the delete key is ignored and delete forward actually deletes backward. This is using one of the new aluminum keyboards on an iMac 20", OS X 10.4.10. US English keyboard layout.

[Trogdor]

When entering my name for the high scores list, the delete key is ignored and delete forward actually deletes backward. This is using one of the new aluminum keyboards on an iMac 20", OS X 10.4.10. US English keyboard layout.

I have this problem, too, and I have a plain old standard white Mac keyboard with US English layout, so I don't think it has anything to do with the keyboard.

[Dave]

Hi, everybody - I have been reading and working on the issues you mention.

1) The delete thing is just me being dumb - I've got that fixed already.

2) I didn't realize the enter key wasn't working (my iBook doesn't have that key, unless hit Fn-Return) - I'll get that fixed.

3) Would having the pause only animate when Snood is the frontmost window be good enough? Or would you like an option for no-animation pause?

4) You can click the mouse to advance through the bonus countup quickly, both on Snood and Snoodoku

5) The aiming is handled completely differently (actually far more rigorously, mathematically speaking). Several folks have said it's harder to squeeze into gaps, but it's mathematically almost the same - I did a comparison between the old aiming regime and the new, and they agreed perfectly for about 98% of shots. Maybe that 2% is the squeezy shots, though. Also, depending on how large a window you used in 3.01, the launcher may be placed in a slightly different location than before, since it's standardized now for all window sizes.

For me (and some others), I've found a little adjustment period that's annoying, and then it seems largely the same to me, but obviously, if it's not making people happy, I can try to tweak it to allow for more flexibility in squeezing and in other ways. If you can be as specific as possible in what you don't like about the aiming, that will help me make the adjustments. I want you all to be happy!

6) I'll figure out what's going on in the saved games - I'm not quite sure what that is.

Thanks for all the feedback - I'm working on it!

Sincerely,
Dave

[Trogdor]

3) Would having the pause only animate when Snood is the frontmost window be good enough? Or would you like an option for no-animation pause? An option for a no-animation pause would be nice, but I could live with an animation only when Snood is the frontmost window.


4) You can click the mouse to advance through the bonus countup quickly, both on Snood and Snoodoku Hmmm...yes, I see. It's not that quick, but a little quicker. ;)

[Trogdor]

Random request:

Is there some way to make the Snood game window open up in the middle of the screen instead of all the way to the left?

It's blocking my buddy list, and I have to move it over each time I launch the game. ;)

[gonad]

When you pause a game after completing a level (when the stats come up) and resume the game, you still have to clear another block of snoods even though the board is empty.

[gonad]

Also, why is it now "cheesy" to have a lot of magic snoods?

[Dave]

I think the heavy use of magic snoods was always cheesy, but I could be wrong on that - I'd have to check my code archives.

I can have it remember the window position as well as the size - I'll add that to my list.

Thanks for the report on the pause bug - I'll get on that.

[Trogdor]

Please tell me it is not impossible to win the Armageddon level. ;)

I have come so close. :p

[Trogdor]

And the answer is, yes it's possible. :D

Go me. :cool:

[Trogdor]

A question about saving games.

I am wondering why the decision was made not to allow saving games when playing the Journey, only with Puzzle games.

I have never completed the Journey, partly because a complete game takes way too long to play, and I don't have that kind of time to sit at my computer and just play. I have always used Snood-playing as a kind of work break (you know, like a coffee break ;)).

[schwhite@mac.com]

It shoots way too slow. I like it when the pieces rocket out of the shooter. In the last version you could adjust the speed in preferences, but I couldn't find it in this version. Also, the first time I played the game, I thought there was a way to start the Journey at Evil, but the second time I played, I couldn't figure out how to do that.

[Dave]

The Game Play Speed setting under the Game Preferences should allow you to speed up play. Try increasing the number there.

The "Evil Journey" option is on there too, third box down under "Other Settings."

[Dave]

About the Journey saves - there has been some pretty stiff competition on the Journey high score lists over the years, and having saved games to load would make those lists meaningless, since you could just reload your game if you died. For most folks, a Journey game lasts about 15-20 minutes, tops, but there are the more gifted folks out there. I could add it if people really wanted it as an option, but I think I'd have to make it so that a game loaded from a saved Journey wouldn't be reportable on the world high score list. Would that be OK?

[schwhite@mac.com]

Dave,

In reply to my complaint, you stated the following:

"The Game Play Speed setting under the Game Preferences should allow you to speed up play. Try increasing the number there.

The "Evil Journey" option is on there too, third box down under "Other Settings.""

I don't have a Game Play Speed under Game Preferences. I also don't have anything called "other settings". What's up???

[Dave]

What version are you using? Maybe we're not talking about the same thing.

[schwhite]

I'm using Version 4 Beta.

[Trogdor]

About the Journey saves - there has been some pretty stiff competition on the Journey high score lists over the years, and having saved games to load would make those lists meaningless, since you could just reload your game if you died. Yeah, I knew that would be a problem if you suddenly allow folks to save Journey games.
For most folks, a Journey game lasts about 15-20 minutes, tops, but there are the more gifted folks out there. Are you talking about games where people don't get to very many levels? I know that when I have made it to higher levels, my games have lasted much longer than 15-20 minutes. I don't know how many levels the Journey even has, but my friend finished the whole game once and she said it took her a very long time.
I could add it if people really wanted it as an option, but I think I'd have to make it so that a game loaded from a saved Journey wouldn't be reportable on the world high score list. Would that be OK? You mean, make it a cheesy score? ;) I don't report my scored anyway, so that would work for me, unless you think it would create a problem for other players.

[WelshSage]

I have two bugs and a feature request. First bug, the boss key (Y) displays a white screen instead of the spreadsheet. Second bug, the paste key for pasting the registration number does not work. Feature request, Dave, could you make an option so that we could speed up the side to side movement of the cannon. The cannon rotates slower than in Snood 3 and it really drives me insane. Thanks for your hard work.

[Dave]

There's no end to the Journey levels - they just keep popping up Evils until you lose. The best guy I know of has gotten to Evil 56 before losing. Even good players usually only win evil maybe half the time, so a game is unlikely to go beyond a few evil levels unless you're great.

I'll see if I can add a cheesy-score save to Journey levels - it's not a high priority at the moment, since I have bigger problems to fix, but it sounds like a few folks would like it.

[Dave]

I have two bugs and a feature request. First bug, the boss key (Y) displays a white screen instead of the spreadsheet. Second bug, the paste key for pasting the registration number does not work. Feature request, Dave, could you make an option so that we could speed up the side to side movement of the cannon. The cannon rotates slower than in Snood 3 and it really drives me insane. Thanks for your hard work.
The paste thing I know about - sorry about that. I'll get it fixed.

I'll check on the boss key - it's a large image it loads, so maybe it's having trouble. Worked on my iBook, but the graphics capabilities can be different on different machines (and not necessarily better on newer ones). Can you let me know what kind of Mac you're using?

A mouse sensitivity parameter would be a good thing to have - I'll add that to the to-do list.

Thanks,
Dave

[Dave]

schwhite -

There's a dialog box that comes up when you click on Game Preferences on the Preferences menu that should have those options I mentioned. Is that not working for you?

[WelshSage]

I'll check on the boss key - it's a large image it loads, so maybe it's having trouble. Worked on my iBook, but the graphics capabilities can be different on different machines (and not necessarily better on newer ones). Can you let me know what kind of Mac you're using?

MBP 2.33 10.4.10. I just noticed another thing about the boss key. When I press it at the high score list, the window turns white. When I press Y during a game, the window is white with a black bar at the top and left side of the window.

Another feature I miss is the ability to turn the game sound off with the S button.

[WelshSage]

I have also found another bug. The click sound that plays when you click on a menu or button only plays when I click on something once right after I start Snood. It will not play anytime after that.

[Dave]

OK, I'll check into that too. Thanks for the report.

[ephraimephraim]

I finally made it past level 35 ("Perfection") last night despite being unable to save and restore games. (How's the fix for that coming along?) And then even though I did Perfection perfectly, I found myself at the enter-your-name screen without any sign that I'd finished all the levels. Are there only 35 playable levels in the beta test? I'm used to the full game with 50.

[WelshSage]

I have another suggestion for Snood. When Snood loses window focus during a game, it should automatically pause. For example, when I command tab to another program from Snood, it should pause. Currently, if I command tab out and don't pause, the only way I can get back into Snood without wasting a shot, is to command tab back into it. If I click on the window while Snood is not in focus and not paused, I waste a shot.

[Dave]

There are 50 levels, but there's some kind of error (also present in the Windows version) that occasionally ends the game early at 35. That'll get fixed.

The game should pause as you've described, but I don't have that worked into the Mac version yet.

I'm working on the web stuff now, but these other fixes are on the way.

[derekrobinson]

I finally made it past level 35 ("Perfection") last night despite being unable to save and restore games. (How's the fix for that coming along?) And then even though I did Perfection perfectly, I found myself at the enter-your-name screen without any sign that I'd finished all the levels. Are there only 35 playable levels in the beta test? I'm used to the full game with 50.

In puzzle level, you can really enhance your scores by hitting escape when the points addition is going on. You receive those points, play three last Snoods again and it adds it all up again.
Not a fair reflection though.

[Trogdor]

There's no end to the Journey levels - they just keep popping up Evils until you lose. The best guy I know of has gotten to Evil 56 before losing. Even good players usually only win evil maybe half the time, so a game is unlikely to go beyond a few evil levels unless you're great.

I'll see if I can add a cheesy-score save to Journey levels - it's not a high priority at the moment, since I have bigger problems to fix, but it sounds like a few folks would like it.

Eh, I don't really need a save to Journey levels. I would be more interested if there were an actual end to Journey, but seeing as there isn't, it doesn't really matter to me.

I suspect my friend who told me she "finished" the Journey was mixing up the Journey with the Puzzle game - which I have finished also.

[Trogdor]

I uninstalled and reinstalled beta4 and uncovered a weird behavior.

I was playing puzzle. I hit "pause." When I hit "resume" I get a blank game board. Totally blank.

[rpeyster]

I am having trouble with registering the game. I enter my code, it says I am registered, but as soon as I close the game and reopen it, it says I am unregistered. I have entered the code several times, each time it says I am registered, and each time when I close the program, the registration is lost. Any advice? (fyi, I am using Mac OS 10.5.1)

[Dave]

Sorry about the trouble. It's possible you don't have write permission to the folder where Snood is. Try moving the game to your home directory or your desktop and see if it works there.

I'm working on fixing this for the next version, but it's a bit tricky.

Sincerely
Dave

[rpeyster]

Thank you! moving the application appears to have worked.

[Trogdor]

I tried moving the application and it still won't let me enter my code.

[Dave]

Sorry about the trouble. Do you mean that it won't store your code after you type it in, or it won't let you type it in at all?

[anarchie76]

Hello Dave,

First of all, thanks for a wonderful game!

However, two major niggles remain.

The first is that twice I've reached Perfection on Beta 6.1 of Version 4.0. Twice I've completed it correctly. And twice I've gone straight into the Game Over sequence. It is very frustrating.
I assume it is because at the end of the level the lowest Numbskull gets into the aiming area, which therefore (a) is not empty and (b) contains a Numbskull, therefore the player must have lost.

The second is that the maximum calculated score for a block of snoods falling is 10000 plus a few odd numbers (usually around 10065, 10135, etc.). Is this a deliberate restriction to avoid stupidly high scores, or simply the result of using a 4-digit field to hold the "squared" element of the score?
I'm running on a MacBook Pro 2.4 GHz, 2 GB memory, under OS X 10.5.1.

Happy New Year to all,

Archie

[Trogdor]

Sorry about the trouble. Do you mean that it won't store your code after you type it in, or it won't let you type it in at all?

It won't let me type or paste my code in at all.

[Dave]

Sorry, I should have asked more clearly - can you get to the screen where you enter the code, and then the box just won't accept typing, or can you not even get to the code entry screen?

[Dave]

I'm getting the Perfection level fixed - that's a problem that shows up on PC and Mac. Sorry about that.

The 10,000 point cap for drop bonus is to restrict ultra-high scores. Some folks were designing puzzle levels that created huge drops worth a bajillion points, so I capped it. I wanted to make it so that the overall scoring for puzzle level games wasn't just blown away by a single level with huge drops and actually reflected progressing through all the levels. The extra points above 10,000 are those you get for eliminating the group of Snoods that triggers the drop.

Interestingly, in the first version of Snood in 1996, I used a short signed integer for the scoring, and when people got over 32,768 points, their score turned negative. That was in version 1.0, before puzzle levels were added, so only really, really good folks got that on Evil. I got that fixed pretty fast.

[snoodtest]

Using Snood 4 beta (downloaded today), on an iBook G3 400MHz, the game background appearsas a scrambled mismash of graphics, which change and evolve over time. The Snoods themselves look fine.

I'm going to try to attach a screenshot, as there's no way to describe it verbally.

It's actually kind of cool to look at, but of course makes the game unplayable. Presumably it's something to do with the fact that it's running on a G3.

I'd really like to see this fixed, as my mom (a registered user) loves the game and will certainly upgrade if the game works OK on her machine.

Thanks!

PS. To meet the upload file size limits, I had to split the screenshot into two files and apply the heaviest jpeg compression, so they don't look as clear as the originals.

[snoodtest]

While I'm thinking of it, are you familiar with Apple's "Shark" optimization tool? Now that the game is Universal Binary, I assume you're using Xcode, so Shark is now available to you. It can work wonders toward getting you snappy performance on older hardware.

I mention this because the Mac beta 4 seems rather sluggish on the 400 MHz G3. Obviously this is extremely old hardware, but previous versions ran acceptable, and I bet this one will too, with a little optimization.

Shark, and the new tools under Leopard ("Instruments", used to be called XRay) make it enjoyable and quick to locate those spots that are slowing things down. I urge you too check it out the benefits to Snood and the other Mac WOM games could be great.

Thanks for listening.

[Trogdor]

Sorry, I should have asked more clearly - can you get to the screen where you enter the code, and then the box just won't accept typing, or can you not even get to the code entry screen?

I can get to the code entry screen. It wouldn't let me paste in my code, which is how I registered my copy of Snood in the past. However, I just tried typing in the code symbol by symbol and it has let me register now. Thanks for your help.

[Trogdor]

I had my first try at saving a puzzle game. When I try to "load" a saved game, that rolling beachball appears and Snood hangs for minutes and minutes. The only solution is to forcequit the application.

I am on an iMac G5 PPC, OS 10.4.11.

[Trogdor]

I had my first try at saving a puzzle game. When I try to "load" a saved game, that rolling beachball appears and Snood hangs for minutes and minutes. The only solution is to forcequit the application.

I am on an iMac G5 PPC, OS 10.4.11.

An addendum to the above:
If I even go to "Open a Saved Game" I lose my cursor, even if I am not trying to load a saved game. The only way I have been able to forcequit is by using Shift-Option-⌘- Esc

[Trogdor]

There are 50 levels, but there's some kind of error (also present in the Windows version) that occasionally ends the game early at 35. That'll get fixed.

The game should pause as you've described, but I don't have that worked into the Mac version yet.

I'm working on the web stuff now, but these other fixes are on the way.

My recent puzzle game ended at level 40.

[kellyryer]

Hi Dave,

I'm thrilled that you are working on an Intel Mac version. I agree with the other comments about a certain sluggishness, almost like play in the steering wheel on a car. I am finding the "squeezy" shots difficult.

Also, is it possible to resize the play window? I have a large external screen, and the window is so large that my arm and wrist quickly tire from normal play.

Also, I was hoping that a native version wouldn't run the fan so much as 3.0, but it seems exactly the same. It's worse than Photoshop!

Glad you're still producing Snood -- I think I've been playing for 10 years now.

-Kelly

[Dave]

Trogdor - glad registering finally worked, sorry about the trouble. The open and save puzzle game part isn't working right yet - I'm fixing up the Windows version now and will do the Mac version immediately afterward.

Snoodtest - I've seen the mixed-up graphics on one other mac, also a non-intel one. I think it has to do with the texture matrix in OpenGL being somehow not set to identity. I'll check out your Shark recommendation, too - thanks.

The Perfection level bug is smushed, too.

[Dave]

Kelly -

You can adjust the play speed on the Game Preferences - I bet you can get it going more snappily. If you read this, can you tell me what you get when you hit F1 while playing? If that's > 20 ms, it can get a little slow.

I'm working on the other issues - I've just finished a new Windows version that I'm sending to Jeff and Ilene to try out, and the Mac version is next.

[Trogdor]

Just curious to know how the Mac version of Snood is coming along. Will there be another beta soon?

[Dave]

It has my full attention now that classes are over. I'm getting the web code to work so Mac users can use the game of the day feature, and I'll get the last few features added after that. I'm also trying to figure out some of the speed issues. I've looked into moving it to SDL from GLUT, but I'll probably put out another GLUT version before taking that on.

The timing is tough to say - depends on how tricky this web stuff is - but I am optimistic about something by mid June.

[jimmy]

Just found one minor bug in Snood 4 beta 6.1

The Just one more game function doesn't quit Snood after the games has finished. The screen saying the game will now quit shows up but upon clicking ok it doesn't quit.

Running MacBook Pro Mac OS 10.5.5